I had to ask because I know of absolutely NOBODY running one in a car or truck and I am contemplating building one.

Currently I run a little boosted 5.0L in a heavy 5000lbs 4x4. I am ok with the way it runs, but would love to transplant this motor in my Maverick and build a few more cubes for this heavy truck.. I was surfing for options and came across a rotating assembly at Coast. But I have no knowlede on this motor as far as reliability, longevity, etc.. I read a couple of dyno pulls in Richard Holdeners Dyno book and the numbers are pretty damn impressive! (tuned properly of course)

Going the boosted - stroked route would deffinately be a bit cheaper than putting boost to a big block in this truck...

_________________
93 F150 4x4 - A9M/A9P - 5.0 /E4OD w 3000 stall, TW Heads, Ross @ 8to1, Kenne Bell @ 10 psi, 77mm ProM, 42lbs injestors, 75mm BBK, TwEECer RT, Baumann TCS, Innovate XD-1, LM-1 & LC-1, EA
Coming soon - Water/Methanol Injection
www.enemyconcepts.com

There will be a 418 windsor stroker running with an A9L EEC-IV sometime after the first off the year..............If he will hurry up and finish it.....

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

Ok a guy that I know just ordered the 393 cast crank stroker kit from CHP. It has the good h-beam rods & forged pistons etc. Will post impressions when I get to take a look at it in a couple of weeks. Do not know if he had them balance it or what yet.

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

I have a 427 on the engine stand just waiting to be stabbed into my 67.




It won't be an EFI car, at least not initially.
It's a 94 Lightning hydraulic roller block.
As far as the rotating assembly, the crank is a billet SCAT crank.
It's my understanding that to get that much stroke, you have to go billet if you're going to put alot of stress on it.
It has Eagle Hbeam rods and the pins don't even go up into the oil ring land.
It has AFR 205 heads.
The Desktop Dyno estimates about 580 hp and torque.

_________________
97 Cobraleen GT
Processor: DDX4, Strategy: CDAN4
Tweecer RT, CalEdit, CalCon
4.6 SOHC, SVO Intake & Heads, Vortech S/C, 12#s boost
38# Injectors, No FMU
370 RWHP

That is nice. It should make the '67 go down the road very nicely....

What was the final bore and stroke on the 427? Did you buy a stroker kit or just buy the parts individually?

I have an early model 351w block that I was going to use on the 418 but I think that I have just about decided to buy a 4 bolt aluminum block as I am fabricating a twin turbo setup for it, with small turbo's of course. The 4 bolt aluminum block is supposed to handle more hp & stress than the earlier '69-'70 model blocks, from what they say? I just want to see if it can make the power that everybody say's they are getting out of the 32v 4.6 liter engines...... And basically see what the actual cost difference is building this instead of a 32v 4.6 liter.

Post pictures when you get it set in the car. That thing is going to be a monster...

(Edit 6/1/05 - Well the Aluminum block idea is now gone as there have been some major problems with them in the past little while. I have just decided to use the early model vintage converted 4 bolt main block...)

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

Thanks Dale.
It's got a 4.030" bore and a 4.187" stroke.
I actually bought the shortblock used so I don't have all the particulars on the individual parts - sorry.
Yeah if you can spring for an aftermarket block, that would be the way to go.
I spent alot of time looking for a Lightning block and they're rare and expensive.
Good luck on the project!

Joe

_________________
97 Cobraleen GT
Processor: DDX4, Strategy: CDAN4
Tweecer RT, CalEdit, CalCon
4.6 SOHC, SVO Intake & Heads, Vortech S/C, 12#s boost
38# Injectors, No FMU
370 RWHP

Thanks Joe. I just could not see sinking all that money into a 4.6L engine and not having the torque that I was after if you know what I mean....
I think you are correct as I have already started saving for the block. I found a used one but I have not had a chance to look at it yet.
I know what you mean about the Lightning blocks as I had been looking for one myself until I found the '69 block that I have now.
Yes I am going to need a lot of luck on this one......and time.

Dale

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

Joe, that has to be one of the prettiest pictures I have seen in a while! ( And the Ole Lady's been gone, so I can put whatever wallpaper up I want!!) I want to here all about that motor whan you get it fired if you have the time to post it. I have a feeling I'm gunna be all over one of those....

Jon

_________________
93 F150 4x4 - A9M/A9P - 5.0 /E4OD w 3000 stall, TW Heads, Ross @ 8to1, Kenne Bell @ 10 psi, 77mm ProM, 42lbs injestors, 75mm BBK, TwEECer RT, Baumann TCS, Innovate XD-1, LM-1 & LC-1, EA
Coming soon - Water/Methanol Injection
www.enemyconcepts.com

I've driven my blown GT for about 3 years now but before that it was all big-cube muscle.
It's taken a while for me to get used to how to drive a 4.6 for maximum pleasure (ie, it needs rpms!).
But it will be nice to have a vehicle again that has 400 lb-ft of torque at only 3000 rpms!

_________________
97 Cobraleen GT
Processor: DDX4, Strategy: CDAN4
Tweecer RT, CalEdit, CalCon
4.6 SOHC, SVO Intake & Heads, Vortech S/C, 12#s boost
38# Injectors, No FMU
370 RWHP

Thanks Jon
I see by your avatar that you're in Denton, Nebraska.
Not sure where that is exactly but I've made a few trips to Beatrice over the last year for work.
Nice change from Houston, and the only place I've ever found red beer!
Joe

_________________
97 Cobraleen GT
Processor: DDX4, Strategy: CDAN4
Tweecer RT, CalEdit, CalCon
4.6 SOHC, SVO Intake & Heads, Vortech S/C, 12#s boost
38# Injectors, No FMU
370 RWHP

Breakfast of champions...red beer....!

Denton is a little shoebox town of about 150 idiots (myself included) 35 miles north of Beatrice...Don't blink! You'll miss the town and possibly hit a barn...or cow....or horse... or worse - Lincoln..

_________________
93 F150 4x4 - A9M/A9P - 5.0 /E4OD w 3000 stall, TW Heads, Ross @ 8to1, Kenne Bell @ 10 psi, 77mm ProM, 42lbs injestors, 75mm BBK, TwEECer RT, Baumann TCS, Innovate XD-1, LM-1 & LC-1, EA
Coming soon - Water/Methanol Injection
www.enemyconcepts.com

So what's special about the Lightning blocks? I was under the impression any F4TZ 351W block is roller compatible.

I think you're correct, it's just that they've become termed "Lighning blocks" because every Lightning had them, and no cars were available with them.
You can also find this block in some vans and other trucks.
And I believe they were only available in 94 & 95 so that makes the supply pretty short.

_________________
97 Cobraleen GT
Processor: DDX4, Strategy: CDAN4
Tweecer RT, CalEdit, CalCon
4.6 SOHC, SVO Intake & Heads, Vortech S/C, 12#s boost
38# Injectors, No FMU
370 RWHP

I know what you mean about the 4.6 liter engines. I really liked the '03 Mach 1 that I had but with the amount of raw torque (without a power adder) that I am looking for it was going to cost a small fortune to get the HP & Torque that I wanted. My wife and I sat down one night to put it all down on paper to see what the final cost was going to be with the initial cost of the car figured in and we both like to have had a heart attack... The cost estimate for the whole project was going to be in the $45,000-$50,000 range with the initial cost of the car and all engine work, TT setup, fuel system etc. I just could not bring myself to spend that kind of money on a toy that would only be driven occasionally. So I have taken another route as the '93 GT car is already payed for it got the vote as I already have most of the major items laying around in the shop etc. I guess I am just spoiled on big cubic inch motors with a lot of raw HP & Torque. Although some of the 4.6L 32v engine do run very well....


Dale

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

Do you guys know what the limitation of the Dart Iron Eagle block is? I have talked to a few people that say that no one knows yet. The highest HP that I know of anyone making with this block is around 1400-1500.

I did finally get a price on a 9.5" deck 4.125 bore 351w based Dart block with the Cleveland mains and the rotating assembly to build a 428. It is going to be a lot cheaper than the 4.6L 32v short block was going to be with comparable components...... And that makes me very happy.

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

A month or so ago I tuned a 421 CI Windsor in a 93 Lightning. It was naturally aspirated, big Pro Top Line Heads (or something like that) 42lb injectors and around 10.5:1 compression. The cam was waaay too small and running out of steam, but it still managed to make 360 hp and around 400 ft lbs of TQ from 2500 or so on up. Can't wait to see what it will do with the right cam, it was hurting it big time.

The truck still ran the stock speed density Lightning EEC and had excellent street manners.

_________________
Thanks,
Raymond
Performance Specialties

That is good to know. I am planning on running the EEC-IV w/MAF as I have modified some of the code in it and want to see what it will do. You know me always tinkering...

I am trying to shoot for at least 450-500 hp before the turbo's are put in place, 800-1000hp after the turbo installation. I talked to Lee last night and he suggested that I give Ed Curtis a call for the cam recommendations.

Raymond do you happen to know anyone locally (in your area) that you would recommend?

TIA,
Dale

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

Hi Dale, I do not see 450 or higher being that hard. That 421 probably could make 450 easily with the right cam. And the 360 was through an E4OD.

Locally do you mean for the cam ? I always like using Cam Motion, Terry has always done us Lightning guys right.

_________________
Thanks,
Raymond
Performance Specialties

Raymond, I forgot about the E4OD in the lightnings as that does drain a few HP. Yes I did mean for the cam. I will give Cam Motion a call and see what Terry recommends for this setup. I will let you know what he suggests.

By the way the 347 car is almost complete (again) should be running in a couple of weeks..... Then I will make a trip to FW/Tyler to deliver it to Troy so he can blow it up.....

I will send you some pictures of the block etc. when it gets here, I know you can use some more junk mail.....

Dale

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

Well guys I messed up the kit that he had ordered was from ADPerformance. He has had it a while now I did not realize that he already had it...It is a Scat 418w stroker setup with a light weight knife edged crank, hbeam rods w/ARP hardware & JE custom pistons. Very very nice setup. The quality is excellent.....

Also if anyone needs good pricing on kits, blocks, heads etc. www.adperformance.com is the cheapest place that I have found for the high quality items that I was looking for........And Brian is excellent to deal with from what I have heard and experienced first hand.

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

393W on a C3P3 here... love it

_________________
393W in a Bronco

Do you have any idea how much hp/torque you are making with the 393W? Also was there any major wiring issues etc.?

I have a friend that is wanting to put one in a early model bronco also. I do not know what his intentions are for the vehicle yet though as far as it being used for off road etc.

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

Dale - another cam guy that I highly recommend is Buddy Rawls. Buddy is in Alabama, and a very cool guy.

His site hasn't been updated for a while but you can still reach him through it:
http://www.wighat.com/fcr3/

Ed vs Buddy - IMHO, buddy is more of a "good ole boy" from Alabama, and Ed is more of a "take it or leave it guy". Both have multiple posts on the corral.net, with Buddy gettting the nod from me on manners and attitude. Both are prob. equal in cam design, I just like Buddy's attitude better.

Ed is prob. a little more race biased - in other words, he seems to concentrate on pure race combos, and often recommends the raciest parts (heads/exhaust) for combs where it has been clearly stated they are/will be street cars.

Buddy seems to take the combo and the use a little more into consideration, IMHO.

Anyways, that's my .02 cents worth...

_________________
Richard White
X3Z, RT, GT40y's, ported intakes, Steeda #18, AFM PP, 80mm Pro-M, MSD, MAC E/L, Dr Gas X, 3.73, etc.

I do Reproduction Mustang Window Stickers!

"Tweecer Defs" http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/twe ... mentation/

Richard, Thanks for the info. I also had noticed that Ed was more biased towards the pure race oriented stuff even after he ahd been told it would be used for street also as well as the track. I had been doing some checking around and I had heard from a few people that his attitude was not as good as it could be in this regard.........

IMHO you do not always need one that makes the most HP as torque is what gets the car moving on the street. If the cam gets to radical it is a pain to drive on the street anyway.

I will give Buddy a call also just to see what his recommendations are for my setup. I should be ready sometime in the fall of this year as I got side tracked on the pickup that I told you about earlier.

Again thanks for the info.

Dale

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

A buddy of mine has one of Buddy's cam in his volvo v8 conversion car. He wanted a friendly cam and wanted it to be a torque monster and pure street driven car. You can PM him through the corral.net - his username is "Michael Yount". Tell him I sent you, and he'll tell you how pleased he is with Buddy's setup...

_________________
Richard White
X3Z, RT, GT40y's, ported intakes, Steeda #18, AFM PP, 80mm Pro-M, MSD, MAC E/L, Dr Gas X, 3.73, etc.

I do Reproduction Mustang Window Stickers!

"Tweecer Defs" http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/twe ... mentation/

Will do.

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

Just an FYI for you guy's Lee H. finally got the Milodon 4 bolt main caps installed on his early model 351w block and lined honed it at work. I took some pictures with the digital camera and will try to get them up sometime tonight....

I did not realize that "a few" of the earlier model 351w blocks were so beefy in the pan rail and main webbing area.....

Anyway it is going to be a very nice setup.....

He is shooting for around 650fwhp NA before the power adder......I think he will make it with this one.......

Well the 351w stroker project has "finally" started for the '93gt car..... I have not finalized the cubic inch yet as I need to have the block sonic tested to see what the wall thickness actually is.....I think that it will go 418-421 cubic inch with a 4.000-4.100 stroke and still leave enough in the cylinders so that the pistons are stable at 7000rpm. Will just have to see.....

Also I could not link pictures of Lee's block for some reason. I will look at that later to see what the problem is......

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor

Sweet! Swing by TN so I can take it for a spin...

_________________
Richard White
X3Z, RT, GT40y's, ported intakes, Steeda #18, AFM PP, 80mm Pro-M, MSD, MAC E/L, Dr Gas X, 3.73, etc.

I do Reproduction Mustang Window Stickers!

"Tweecer Defs" http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/twe ... mentation/

I just may do that next year if I can get it all finished.....

By the way I bought the '91lx 347 Sleeper back from Troy D. about 2 weeks ago. I posted some pictures of it in the pictures section on the EEC-Editor Yahoo Forum if you want to go take a look.....

_________________
'88GT, T-Top (Being rebuilt)-Moates Hardware waiting....
BE & EEC Analyzer
'93 Teal Cobra-Moates Hardware
Paul's EEC-Editor