Need injector suggestion

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Mfs
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Need injector suggestion

Post by Mfs » Mon Jun 12, 2017 11:59 pm

Will these fit? A 5.8l ford truck engine:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/122349326224
I have aluminum heads Edelbrock truck intake, BBK throttle body and cam. And are they too big? Will 24# ford 460 injector work?
1995 ford f-150 4x4 street legal pre-runner. week end fun truck. 351 speed density, eec# jog1, pro comp gt-40 style alum heads, comp cam#35-351-8 218/224 @.050 114 lobe sp. roller rockers, 3881 edelbrock intake, 56mm bbk, shorty headers, custom y pipe, 3" cat and exhaust, e4od w shift kit,

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Paulie
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Re: Need injector suggestion

Post by Paulie » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:35 am

They will probably work but if you are going to be tuning this you would be much better off getting injectors that have published specs available. FRPP and Seimens Deka are both good choices.
1990 Mustang 5.0, HCI, Vortech S-trim, FRPP 42# inj., PMAS MH95, A9L, Moates Quarterhorse, BE/EA, Innovate LC-1.

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cgrey8
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Re: Need injector suggestion

Post by cgrey8 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:40 am

My guess is he's mesmerized by the price tag. I doubt you'll find a new set of 8 Dekas for $70.
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89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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Mfs
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Re: Need injector suggestion

Post by Mfs » Sat Jun 17, 2017 1:36 am

Ev1 injectors fit?
1995 ford f-150 4x4 street legal pre-runner. week end fun truck. 351 speed density, eec# jog1, pro comp gt-40 style alum heads, comp cam#35-351-8 218/224 @.050 114 lobe sp. roller rockers, 3881 edelbrock intake, 56mm bbk, shorty headers, custom y pipe, 3" cat and exhaust, e4od w shift kit,

LeadHead
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Re: Need injector suggestion

Post by LeadHead » Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:12 pm

If you're spending all the money on this motor, just get the Deka 60s or 80s and do it right.

decipha

Re: Need injector suggestion

Post by decipha » Mon Jun 26, 2017 5:10 am

injectors are one of the most critical component in an engine, don't skimp on them

you'll need at least 30lb/hr injectors minimum

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cgrey8
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Re: Need injector suggestion

Post by cgrey8 » Mon Jun 26, 2017 7:05 am

There's a gamut of perspective that only the buyer can decide.

But I think it is quite safe to say that old EV1 injectors are old technology. But for their time, they were still better than a carb when the injectors were sized for production vehicles that were not performance-oriented. The design was simple, a single hole in the bottom of the injector with a pintle needle as a valve to control the fuel flow. They were better than carb, but their flow pattern was still a near-solid stream pattern...not a fine mist like injectors can produce today. When it came to aftermarket mods that demanded much larger than production injectors could supply fuel for, you couldn't install much more than 42lb injectors without having fueling issues at idle just because fuel control at low-flow conditions was iffy. Some cylinders were firing rich, others lean, and sometimes it wasn't always consistent. So idling "built" engines was difficult even if the cam wasn't loping it. And even then, you did pay more for injectors that were tested to be matched-sets. To get "better" than matched sets, your only option was low-impedance injectors which require a special injector controller to properly handle the higher current demand of a low-impedance coil (most production EECs only fire high impedance injectors). I think Denso made most EV1s we think of as the "fat" body injectors, but I'm sure there were/are other mfgs. In the 80s, GM didn't use Denso. They used somebody else (can't remember who). But they had a fundamental design issue with their injectors when ethanol got introduced into the US fuel supply in high quantities. The material they potted the injector coil with was not ethanol-resistant. Add to that, the potting material was in direct contact with the fuel. So when ethanol came about, these old injectors started failing because the potting was being dissolved by the ethanol and eventually the coil was exposed. And as you might guess, the ethanol came in contact with the coils and corroded them to failure.

Bosch came out with the EV6s sometime in the 90s. I believe from the start, they used a 4-hole spray pattern instead of a single pintle spray to get a little more mist than stream. This gave them MUCH better atomization on production-sized injectors AND better internals gave them better fuel flow control for the larger flow models. And tighter emissions demands were pushing the industry to use these newer-generation injectors. And for people that just wanted to preserve the "original look" of their old school hot rods, I believe there are the 4-hole injectors made into a "fat" body housing so you can get EV6 quality fuel delivery while maintaining the original look under the hood.

But injector technology didn't stop there. Siemens and Bosch both continued development due to further stringent emissions fuel economy demands. And both have found better atomization techniques to get finer and finer mist from their spray patterns as well as better and better flow control even at flow rates as high as 80lb/hr. While it isn't mentioned much, this became very important for FlexFuel vehicles since ethanol doesn't atomize nearly as well as gasoline does. So in the winter most any vehicle running high concentrations of ethanol isn't going to crank as easily thus furthering the need for a finer mist from injectors to coerce the ethanol into the air on crank.

Point is, technology has improved. So while a set of used old school injectors might fit and might run the engine, they may (or may not) cause you issues when it comes to idling or cranking. But one thing you can be assured of is if you go with newer technology injectors, problems with things like idle are not likely to be blamed on the injectors.
...Always Somethin'

89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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