97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning questions

Anything about Ford EEC tuning. TwEECer and Moates questions dominate, but there's some SCT and OBD-II knowledge too.

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daet1234
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97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning questions

Post by daet1234 » Thu Oct 22, 2015 12:45 pm

I have a 97 ford explorer motor mated to a tremec 3550 in a 81 ford fairmont station wagon. It is running on a modified wiring harness and the stock sll4 computer with the CTBAE strategy. It starts, runs, drives, and stops well but it could be better especially after some more engine upgrades.

http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthread. ... pice-it-up

I have not purchased anything for computer tuning yet because I am unsure of the capabilities. First, I have not found the CTBAE strategy to maybe look at. Second, I am not sure if the hardware and/or software can delete the auto transmission. I really want to keep the EEC V comp and the DIS. I am also working on installing the explorer Instrument cluster in the fairmont. The hardware and software I have been eyeing is the Quarterhorse and Binary Editor with Analyzer.

Can the hardware and/or software accommodate the trans delete? Does anyone have a copy of the CTBAE strategy? Has anyone have any experience with this type of setup?
1981 Fairtang or Musmont: Fairmont wagon and mustang amalgamation.

strat CDNA4 using deciphas zxa5 base. Tuning with Quarterhorse, Binary Editor, and EEC analyzer.
5.0 fuel injected, DIS, GT40 heads, GT40 intake, 19lbs/h injectors, 65mm throttle body, exhaust: long tube headers to 3" collector sized down to 2.5 dual with Xpipe, Mellings HV oil pump, stock form engine from 97 Exploder mated to a Tremec 3550.

decipha

Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by decipha » Thu Oct 22, 2015 7:49 pm

check with sailorbob i believe he has an explorer strat broken out, not sure which one

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by cgrey8 » Fri Oct 23, 2015 6:03 am

If memory serves, the one he has broken out is CQAB*.
...Always Somethin'

89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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decipha

Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by decipha » Fri Oct 23, 2015 7:24 am

From what I could find

CQAB0 / CQAB1 / CQAB3
97 EXPLORER
ML2-4D1 H/W CODE ONLY

96-97 explorer 5.0L
CTBAE / CTBAF - ML2-336 H/W code only

I'm willing to bet either one of those boxes can swap code or even a cdan4 tune properly configured too since its only 1 digit off

daet, go ahead and order yourself a quarterhorse from moates, shoot me a message when it comes in and i'll shoot you over a binary to write to it that way you don't go getting the wrong strategy, im fairly certain dereks explorer strat should work on it no problem

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by cgrey8 » Fri Oct 23, 2015 1:33 pm

The 96-early97s were the V8 Explorers that had GT40 heads and used a Sonic EGR.
The later 97 (aka 97¼) V8 Explorers used the GT40p heads and the EGR was DPFE.

Both EECs are 2-bank so it's highly likely that with the QH, they would run another similar era 2-bank tune. The CDAN4 EGR would likely need to be disabled. I don't know if CDAN4 is even capable of Sonic EGR if the OP maintained it.

Both use cam/crank sensors to run EDIS.
Both came stock with 19lb EV6 injectors with the EV1 connectors on a return-style fuel system.
Both controlled 4R70w trannys.
Neither had PATS.
I think they both had 70mm MAFs that bolt to the air filter box similar to the 90mm LMAF, just one of the smaller bolt patterns and outlet diameters. You can probably get his stock MAF curve from a CQAB1/XDT2 tune assuming he's using the stock Explorer MAF.

The Explorers didn't go 4-bank until 98. I think that's also when they went to PATS. Ford continued to make a number of other minor tweaks all over the Explorer engine bay from 98-01 including redesign of the GT40 upper/lower, stronger 4R70w, change to front driveshaft on AWD models, 17lb injectors with EV6/USCAR connectors, returnless fuel system (although NOT variable-speed pump), removal of EGR cooling lines, removal of oil cooler, replace the crappy tube exhaust manifolds with cast iron, fuel tank pressure monitoring, etc etc.
...Always Somethin'

89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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decipha

Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by decipha » Fri Oct 23, 2015 2:53 pm

it was still a return setup they just mounted the fuel pressure regulator in the fuel tank, on all the fuel systems I put together i always mount the fpr next to the tank as well, I laught at all the dummies that run two fuel lines :lol:

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by cgrey8 » Sat Oct 24, 2015 5:15 am

That's right.

I still do have the FPR in the stock location for the 97 Explorer, but that's only because the truck was originally setup with 2 lines with the V6. And with the V8, I just maintained that setup since it was convenient. I'm not running nearly enough power to be concerned about whether the stock lines are pushing enough fuel. So there was never a compelling reason to do anything else.
...Always Somethin'

89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Sun Oct 25, 2015 2:59 pm

I asked Derek if he had a REAC4 definition (EQE3 catch code) for my '00 Mountaineer, but no dice.
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by daet1234 » Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:25 pm

I would like to keep the EGR if possible. It does help with the engine efficiency. I also read some were deleting the egr and using the input to run a wideband O2. I could maybe convert the EGR system to the old school vacuum driven EGR and use the input. I could even change the computer to something more amenable to my tuning needs, even if requires rewiring.

Is there a benefit to the 4 bank EEC-V? I am still relatively new to computer tuning but have a backgrounds in electronics, computers, and mechanical. I haven't even touched the internals or externals of the motor save for the oil pump. I still need to upgrade the cam, rockers, injectors, MAF, and throttle body.

I have a little time cause I broke the rear spring perch playing around. Haven't looked too hard at it yet. And it getting to be winter here in Cleveland.
1981 Fairtang or Musmont: Fairmont wagon and mustang amalgamation.

strat CDNA4 using deciphas zxa5 base. Tuning with Quarterhorse, Binary Editor, and EEC analyzer.
5.0 fuel injected, DIS, GT40 heads, GT40 intake, 19lbs/h injectors, 65mm throttle body, exhaust: long tube headers to 3" collector sized down to 2.5 dual with Xpipe, Mellings HV oil pump, stock form engine from 97 Exploder mated to a Tremec 3550.

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:35 pm

daet1234 wrote:I would like to keep the EGR if possible. It does help with the engine efficiency. I also read some were deleting the egr and using the input to run a wideband O2. I could maybe convert the EGR system to the old school vacuum driven EGR and use the input. I could even change the computer to something more amenable to my tuning needs, even if requires rewiring.

Is there a benefit to the 4 bank EEC-V? I am still relatively new to computer tuning but have a backgrounds in electronics, computers, and mechanical. I haven't even touched the internals or externals of the motor save for the oil pump. I still need to upgrade the cam, rockers, injectors, MAF, and throttle body.

I have a little time cause I broke the rear spring perch playing around. Haven't looked too hard at it yet. And it getting to be winter here in Cleveland.
Either Adam at Pops Racing or Derek will have a definition for the '97 Explorer ECM. It's going to be a CQABx definition and I've seen that Paul Booth has a definition for that as well, although it's not nearly complete enough to be worthwhile. I would check with Derek first (I have a pretty good experience using his CDAN4). The other thing is that you could just run CDAN4, you'll just have to set the tune up to work with what you have, ei. 302, properly setup spark tables, fuel maps, etc.
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by daet1234 » Fri Nov 06, 2015 11:16 am

I just received the quarterhorse and binary editor with analyzer. Cool stuff. Then the laptop battery crapped out. Not cool stuff. I suppose I have to run wired. And apparently I can't send PMs.

My goals are to delete the auto trans, modify for new exhaust, then modify for performance. Even in its current iteration this wagon is mean. It spools up so quick its hard to transition the clutch. It must look like I don't know how to drive. After a corrected some of the front end geometry, I did a few runs down our freshly paved street. It is hard to control, it wants to constantly peel and walk the axle. When it is going straight, I have to jam the gears hard almost deflecting the steering wheel. Tons of fun though.

I also noticed the speedometer is off. Should this be corrected in the tune or should I get another vss? The vss came off the exploder with 3.73 gears and I am running 3.55.
1981 Fairtang or Musmont: Fairmont wagon and mustang amalgamation.

strat CDNA4 using deciphas zxa5 base. Tuning with Quarterhorse, Binary Editor, and EEC analyzer.
5.0 fuel injected, DIS, GT40 heads, GT40 intake, 19lbs/h injectors, 65mm throttle body, exhaust: long tube headers to 3" collector sized down to 2.5 dual with Xpipe, Mellings HV oil pump, stock form engine from 97 Exploder mated to a Tremec 3550.

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Mon Nov 09, 2015 12:51 pm

What definition did you end up with?

As for the speedo, not sure if you've got a speedo gear you can replace on your VSS, but you might with the pre-99' Explorer gear. That would make for a simple physical gear change on the unit. If not, then I believe it has to be changed in the VID block (never done that before), but you can also correct how the EEC interprets speed using the ratios exposed in the tune.
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

daet1234
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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by daet1234 » Mon Nov 09, 2015 7:32 pm

I have not been able to track down a definition file for BE. My searching keeps bringing up ghosts when examined dissipate into the ether. Contacted sailorbob, but he doesn't have one for ctbae or a suitable cqab*.

The vss is a physical gear on this transmission. I pulled it out of the exploder trans. I did not know if that is something I should change in the tune or physically.

Right now I am kind of running blind without a way to even display my tune. I kind of looked at a cdan4 configuration, but I am not sure which configuration would be suitable.

I even connected up the obdii connector. The only codes I am getting are all trans codes.

One of my wiring issues I haven't found a good solution to was the fuel guage. Maybe someone has some input.
Fairmont 10 full 75 empty
Explorer 16 full 158 empty
1981 Fairtang or Musmont: Fairmont wagon and mustang amalgamation.

strat CDNA4 using deciphas zxa5 base. Tuning with Quarterhorse, Binary Editor, and EEC analyzer.
5.0 fuel injected, DIS, GT40 heads, GT40 intake, 19lbs/h injectors, 65mm throttle body, exhaust: long tube headers to 3" collector sized down to 2.5 dual with Xpipe, Mellings HV oil pump, stock form engine from 97 Exploder mated to a Tremec 3550.

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by POPSRACING » Tue Nov 10, 2015 8:21 am

All the v8 explorer stuff has been competed, we have direct flash and qh packages available.
Owner Core Tuning (Binary Editor)/ Moates / TwEECer / SCT Dealer /Diablosport / Drewtech
EFI Calibrator Build custom strategies for B.E.
Land and Sea chassis dyno
Phone 585-802-6911 EST Email Adam@CoreTuning.net
http://www.coretuning.net for your tuning software needs...
1995 Cobra, 408, sold...

2013 5.0 Racing Red Automatic Tunes available...

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Wed Nov 11, 2015 12:04 am

Adam, do you have a definition for REAC4? I have an '00 Mountaineer with an EQE3 calibration.

Regarding the VSS being a physical gear, that is good news. The speedo gear drives the speedometer, so that is that. How the EEC interprets this however, can be adjusted using the scalars NVBASE_X_NVC, NVBASE. The EEC has its own vehicle speed processing which is separate from and agnostic to the speedo gear itself. It uses engine RPM and a base "N-over-V" ratio to accurately determine vehicle speed. If you make tire size changes and things like that, you will want to recalibrate these parameters, but once set they are good to go. In any case, I think the main purpose of this independent vehicle speed processing is to support robust transmission shift control logic that is dependent on accurate speeds. For your setup, it's not important - the gear change should be all you would need to correct your speedo.

I would probably toss in Sailorbob's CDAN4 definition into a CDAN4 EEC-V and go from there.
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

POPSRACING
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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by POPSRACING » Wed Nov 11, 2015 7:36 am

Yes we have REAC4 strategy available
Owner Core Tuning (Binary Editor)/ Moates / TwEECer / SCT Dealer /Diablosport / Drewtech
EFI Calibrator Build custom strategies for B.E.
Land and Sea chassis dyno
Phone 585-802-6911 EST Email Adam@CoreTuning.net
http://www.coretuning.net for your tuning software needs...
1995 Cobra, 408, sold...

2013 5.0 Racing Red Automatic Tunes available...

daet1234
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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by daet1234 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 2:24 pm

Decipha sent a test cdan4 strat and bin (thank you.) Didn't work, just ran the pump. I uploaded with tuner pro, and then tried BE. BE kept telling me t configure the pcm type(1 bank, 2 bank, 4 bank), but I could not find an option to do so. It was worth a try. It seems like cdan4 is really supported. Maybe if I run out of options I can retool the wires for a supporting comp. I know at that point I'll lose the sonic EGR feedback. Would the comp still run the EGR without feedback?

I am just eager to start playing around.
1981 Fairtang or Musmont: Fairmont wagon and mustang amalgamation.

strat CDNA4 using deciphas zxa5 base. Tuning with Quarterhorse, Binary Editor, and EEC analyzer.
5.0 fuel injected, DIS, GT40 heads, GT40 intake, 19lbs/h injectors, 65mm throttle body, exhaust: long tube headers to 3" collector sized down to 2.5 dual with Xpipe, Mellings HV oil pump, stock form engine from 97 Exploder mated to a Tremec 3550.

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 4:12 pm

In BE, the Hardware tab has the options to configure the bank configuration. You'll also need to install the appropriate drivers so that BE will recognize the Quarterhorse, Tweecer, or WHY. CDAN4 is widely supported, I would highly recommend tuning with it.
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

daet1234
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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by daet1234 » Thu Nov 19, 2015 10:39 am

Alright, got a plan. I did some research and now I am going with another computer. I prefer the CDAN4 because of its popular support. I located a ZXA3 box out of a 96 Mustang GT. When comparing the wiring diagrams, they were 90% the same. One difference was that there are now 2 fuel pump outputs, one of which displaces something insignificant.

Now all I need is the cam sensor. Can I use a the cam sensor from a 99 Explorer or do I have to gut it and drop in the windstar sensor?
1981 Fairtang or Musmont: Fairmont wagon and mustang amalgamation.

strat CDNA4 using deciphas zxa5 base. Tuning with Quarterhorse, Binary Editor, and EEC analyzer.
5.0 fuel injected, DIS, GT40 heads, GT40 intake, 19lbs/h injectors, 65mm throttle body, exhaust: long tube headers to 3" collector sized down to 2.5 dual with Xpipe, Mellings HV oil pump, stock form engine from 97 Exploder mated to a Tremec 3550.

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Thu Nov 19, 2015 12:20 pm

You can run the stock '99-01 cam sync sensor (2-pin sensor). I'm using Sailorbob's CDAN4 strategy and pretty happy with it at its current iteration. It's controlling a stroked 351W (408 cubes) with 10.3:1 compression, reasonably radical cam, long tube headers, single O2, etc. Starts and runs really nicely.
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

decipha

Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by decipha » Fri Nov 20, 2015 2:14 am

make sure you get the complete cdan4 def from sailorbob or youll be upset

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by POPSRACING » Fri Nov 20, 2015 6:40 am

We could get you the core definition and no converting needed.
Owner Core Tuning (Binary Editor)/ Moates / TwEECer / SCT Dealer /Diablosport / Drewtech
EFI Calibrator Build custom strategies for B.E.
Land and Sea chassis dyno
Phone 585-802-6911 EST Email Adam@CoreTuning.net
http://www.coretuning.net for your tuning software needs...
1995 Cobra, 408, sold...

2013 5.0 Racing Red Automatic Tunes available...

daet1234
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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by daet1234 » Thu Nov 26, 2015 2:22 pm

Obtained CDAN4 def; installed ZXA3 computer; Installed VR sensor; rewired cam sensor(spliced in vss+ from the coolant sensor)

Tried a couple of stupid things, like you know starting the engine on the stock tune, ect. Crap, PATS. After fumbling around in between jobs, I found decipha's ZXA5 base tune. Quick study, some edits, and a little fudging, I got it to stumble. I had almost started to question my wiring. That stumble confirms a lot: wiring, computer validity, non corrupt bin, pats disable, ect.

I am trying to reconcile the required edits with the parameters I know and what I can find. It seems everyone upgrades the 19 lbs injectors and I have no little on them. Time for some learning curve. I guess this is the event horizon.
1981 Fairtang or Musmont: Fairmont wagon and mustang amalgamation.

strat CDNA4 using deciphas zxa5 base. Tuning with Quarterhorse, Binary Editor, and EEC analyzer.
5.0 fuel injected, DIS, GT40 heads, GT40 intake, 19lbs/h injectors, 65mm throttle body, exhaust: long tube headers to 3" collector sized down to 2.5 dual with Xpipe, Mellings HV oil pump, stock form engine from 97 Exploder mated to a Tremec 3550.

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Thu Nov 26, 2015 4:57 pm

Well, I've been down this road recently with a total retrofit so just ask if you have any specific questions.

Also, if you want to run without PATS, VPX3 is another good one to base your tune off of.
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

daet1234
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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by daet1234 » Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:11 pm

More research and edits yielded a longer stumble. A little more I was able to idle, not well, but it was not shutting off.

I used the frpp info for 19lb injectors I don't know that they are the same. I also used the stock 89-90 SC & '93 Cobra - 70mm -PMAS maf transfer info. It seemed to be knocking. I am just used the original Borderline spark table as it seemed a little conservative. I am still working on what the load scaling does, so I kept that original.

This is so much fun. Any input will be graciously accepted.
1981 Fairtang or Musmont: Fairmont wagon and mustang amalgamation.

strat CDNA4 using deciphas zxa5 base. Tuning with Quarterhorse, Binary Editor, and EEC analyzer.
5.0 fuel injected, DIS, GT40 heads, GT40 intake, 19lbs/h injectors, 65mm throttle body, exhaust: long tube headers to 3" collector sized down to 2.5 dual with Xpipe, Mellings HV oil pump, stock form engine from 97 Exploder mated to a Tremec 3550.

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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Fri Nov 27, 2015 8:48 pm

daet1234 wrote:More research and edits yielded a longer stumble. A little more I was able to idle, not well, but it was not shutting off.

I used the frpp info for 19lb injectors I don't know that they are the same. I also used the stock 89-90 SC & '93 Cobra - 70mm -PMAS maf transfer info. It seemed to be knocking. I am just used the original Borderline spark table as it seemed a little conservative. I am still working on what the load scaling does, so I kept that original.

This is so much fun. Any input will be graciously accepted.
I would look at the tune for a '96+ Explorer/Mountaineer for a good baseline for a EEC-V controlled 302, but here's my tune anyway. 351W stroked to 408, using the 4R70W part of the computer. Hope it helps. The car is turnkey with this tune.
Attachments
VPX3_71Mustang_transtune.BEB
'71 Mustang with 408 stroker engine, EEC-V, EDIS8, 4R70W control
(933.72 KiB) Downloaded 149 times
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

daet1234
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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by daet1234 » Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:40 pm

Thanks Shaker666. Was there a base tune used with this? I will probably use the compare tool to check a couple of things. Obviously, they wont match up, but it gives me an idea of what it takes.

I am having an issue with EEC Analyzer. I am trying to dial in the MAF and it is stating that the field can't be blank. I also was utilizing the injector calculator and it would just sit there. The scan tool tab stated that the software had to be registered although I have received the dongle update.

If anyone has a stock CTBAE bin, I sure could use some info:
Injector high/low/bkpt
Borderline spark table
MAF transfer
load scaling

I moved it in the parking lot with the tune that I modified. It reacts a lot better than with the CTBAE. It is however running really rich and the rpms stick when I let off the gas.
1981 Fairtang or Musmont: Fairmont wagon and mustang amalgamation.

strat CDNA4 using deciphas zxa5 base. Tuning with Quarterhorse, Binary Editor, and EEC analyzer.
5.0 fuel injected, DIS, GT40 heads, GT40 intake, 19lbs/h injectors, 65mm throttle body, exhaust: long tube headers to 3" collector sized down to 2.5 dual with Xpipe, Mellings HV oil pump, stock form engine from 97 Exploder mated to a Tremec 3550.

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Shaker666
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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Wed Dec 09, 2015 1:04 am

The basis of the tune is, as the filename suggests, VPX3. It is one of the few calibrations that does not have PATS enabled by default. Sailorbob doesn't want to be a part of potential car thievery or something, so does not expose the PATS enable/disable flags in his CDAN4 strategy definition. Mike's ZXA5 calibration has PATS disabled as well, but something about that calibration prevents proper 4R70W transmission control, so I had to resort to a different base calibration. My '71 Mustang has a 4R70W transmission, of course. I'll just warn you that my tune is heavily modified from the stock VPX3 and a lot of it has mods specifically suggested by Mike, so ZXA5 is highly relevant. That tune is the culmination of about 1 year's worth of fairly consistent datalogging, experimentation, and adjustment. Aside from my idle characteristics in gear at a stop, I've got no complaints!

Read the PDFs for EA to see what fields are required for using the various automatic analysis tabs. That should help.

You might email Sailorbob to inquire about a stock CTBAE bin. He has been quite helpful to me while I was researching solutions and developing my initial tune.
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

decipha

Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by decipha » Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:04 am

the the zxa5 i have all the background auto trans routines disabled

It would probably be a great idea to add a zxa5a for those whom have an auto trans though, ill add it in when i get a chance

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Shaker666
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Re: 97 explorer in 81 fairmont with tremec 3550 tuning quest

Post by Shaker666 » Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:30 am

Yeah, that would help a lot, Mike. I couldn't figure out why the TCC lockup wasn't occurring when I was based off of ZXA5. Switched to VPX3 and bam, lockup! Of course, figuring out that VPX2 and VPX3 did not have PATS enabled was a bit of a journey itself.
'89 5.0L: 8.6:1 Dart 306, GT-40 lower, KB Blowzilla 2.2, LMAF, 90mm TB, 80# injectors, TwEECed A9L w/EDIS8
'79 Bronco on 35s & 4" lift: 8.5:1 400 0.030" over, GT-40 lower, Cobra upper, Cobra 70mm MAF, 65mm TB, 24# injectors, EDIS8, TwEECed A9L, single O2
'71 Mustang: 10.3:1 '69 408W, Victor 5.8 EFI intake, 80mm TB, 90mm LMAF, 42# injectors, JZP3 (CDAN4) Moates QH tuned
'08 Buell XB12Ss: stock 10:1 1203, '10 header, independent O2s, 3 bar MAP, DDFI3 tuned via TunerPro RT

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