2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Anything about Ford EEC tuning. TwEECer and Moates questions dominate, but there's some SCT and OBD-II knowledge too.

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2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Sun Mar 26, 2017 1:36 pm

Hello all, new here and just about finishing up my 5.0 swap from an 00 explorer. Have done a lot of mods to the motor though. Here's the mod list:

Flow tech induction custom high lift cam
Pro-M ev1 30# e85 compatible injectors
HFP-342 255L/hr fuel pump
90mm mass air housing and meter recommended by Torrie @ unleashed (will get specifics on it when I get home, on the SCT Livewire TS+ I bought from him as well there's a maf count for 03-04 cobra as well as a generic maf count)
Stock bottom end just new bearings
Roll master gold timing chain
190cc alum heads, dual Lunati LS valve springs ARP head bolts
Magnum XD roller rockers, ARP studs and guide plates
Ported lower intake by TMoss and them
Stock upper, egr delete plate, no dpfe. Everything unplugged and bypassed via LVTS+ (What do I do with the vacuum lines that run from front of intake to right side of vehicle and line going to egr vacuum solenoid and tank evap system? I have the evap tube and both side vacuum lines connected st the moment)
96 trans which is incorrect, so Torrie has bypassed that by us flashing the ecu to think it's a manual trans
OBX headers, dual 3" tube to x pipe, o2 sensors after each header collector, still using stock o2 sensors in mostly stock locations. Removed all downstream sensors, only have two upstream.
Did crank and cam timing straight up and down (0°), when placing the cam position sensor I had #1 piston @ TDC on intake stroke, sensor dropped right in facing straight forward and everything seemed right. Didn't use a positioning tool.

Now for the issues. Truck will start right up. Idles like a champ. If I touch the gas at all, it will no longer hold an idle. Goes from 400rpm-1600rpm surging until it finally dies. If I hold some throttle it'll stay running. Noticing fuel trim bank 1 is staying at .7, while fuel trim bank 2 is going from 1.15-1.25. Last night while Torrie was sending me other flashes to try, we went from auto trans (sends it to limp mode and both fuel trim banks work properly ~.8x) to a manual trans setting with it not being sent to limp mode. Both banks were changing for a bit then 1 defaulted to .7 again. What could be causing this? In making the ecu think it's a manual trans, is that doing something with the o2 sensor that's in the trans harness? Or is it something to do with the maf? Just trying to narrow things down here and see where I need to go from here. Trying to alleviate some stress off Torrie with the constant emails and troubleshooting. Please let me know if I've missed anything!
Last edited by DRod on Fri Jul 28, 2017 10:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by cgrey8 » Sun Mar 26, 2017 3:57 pm

If you have datalogging ability, then confirm both HEGOs are operating and giving lucid and responsive values. If you don't have a datalogger, you should really seriously consider buying into it particularly if you are wanting to do some of this diagnostic work for yourself. If datalogging just isn't an option, the next best thing is to get a meter on your HEGOs somehow and confirm they are working. The meter should be setup for DC and you should see values between 0-.8v. Technically, O2s can go as high as .9v, although I rarely see datalogs with HEGOs going that high. Most of the time, they are in the 0-0.75v range.
...Always Somethin'

89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Sun Mar 26, 2017 4:10 pm

cgrey8 wrote:If you have datalogging ability, then confirm both HEGOs are operating and giving lucid and responsive values. If you don't have a datalogger, you should really seriously consider buying into it particularly if you are wanting to do some of this diagnostic work for yourself. If datalogging just isn't an option, the next best thing is to get a meter on your HEGOs somehow and confirm they are working. The meter should be setup for DC and you should see values between 0-.8v. Technically, O2s can go as high as .9v, although I rarely see datalogs with HEGOs going that high. Most of the time, they are in the 0-0.75v range.
I'm tying my sct livewire ts+ to my computer to get some data logging asap. According to what I've read elsewhere, STFT 1 reading .7 means that bank is rich, and STFT 2 is lean being above 1 (1 being perfect A/F ratio)

decipha

Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by decipha » Sun Mar 26, 2017 6:06 pm

if one goes full lean and the other goes fill rich it means the hegos are swapped or pin mapped backwards

I know the explorers have the ports assigned backwards in the stock tune, Ive never seen any others like that, in any case tell your guy to swap the ports

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Sun Mar 26, 2017 6:20 pm

decipha wrote:if one goes full lean and the other goes fill rich it means the hegos are swapped or pin mapped backwards

I know the explorers have the ports assigned backwards in the stock tune, Ive never seen any others like that, in any case tell your guy to swap the ports
What about the multiple MAF counts that I'm getting? The numbers are always different and progress at a different rate. The first fuel trim bank starts functioning if I hit the gas considerably. More than half throttle. Goes to .8 or so along with the fuel bank 2

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by cgrey8 » Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:00 pm

decipha wrote:if one goes full lean and the other goes fill rich it means the hegos are swapped or pin mapped backwards

I know the explorers have the ports assigned backwards in the stock tune, Ive never seen any others like that, in any case tell your guy to swap the ports
In the meantime, he can unplug one of the two HEGOs. This will force both banks to use the "working" HEGO. If simply unplugging one alleviates the disparity in STFTs, then yeah, that's confirmation they are backwards. You can leave it that way until you get an update from the tuner.

BTW, I find it interesting that HEGOs can be swapped in the tunes now. I don't believe that feature was possible in the older EEC-IVs was it?
...Always Somethin'

89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Sun Mar 26, 2017 9:29 pm

cgrey8 wrote:
decipha wrote:if one goes full lean and the other goes fill rich it means the hegos are swapped or pin mapped backwards

I know the explorers have the ports assigned backwards in the stock tune, Ive never seen any others like that, in any case tell your guy to swap the ports
In the meantime, he can unplug one of the two HEGOs. This will force both banks to use the "working" HEGO. If simply unplugging one alleviates the disparity in STFTs, then yeah, that's confirmation they are backwards. You can leave it that way until you get an update from the tuner.

BTW, I find it interesting that HEGOs can be swapped in the tunes now. I don't believe that feature was possible in the older EEC-IVs was it?
im only running two upstream sensors, and separate piping from headers to x pipe, no cats, and no downstream sensors plugged in either. Left and right upstreams tapped right after header exit. We're having to flash the ecu thinking it's a manual trans so it's out of limp mode. Would that have an affect on the o2 sensor that's plugged in to the trans harness?

Just ran the truck again with a spark advance view. Truck ran decent at startup with 14-16°, then after a minute or so it slowly started advancing until it got up to 34° and truck was searching all over for idle. Died eventually. What's causing that? Anything physical I need to check?

I have datalog files if anyone wants to check them out...

decipha

Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by decipha » Wed Mar 29, 2017 3:26 am

my tablet erased my post, hate this thing i hope the developer dies in their sleep

x pipe requires hego2 be disabled

yes eec4 u can swap hegos

maf shouldnt fluctuate more than 0.03 volts at a stable condition otherwise it needs screens

pre tune info has buku details

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by cgrey8 » Wed Mar 29, 2017 6:08 am

decipha wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2017 3:26 am
...yes eec4 u can swap hegos...
Care to elaborate? Without details, it's a useless comment.
...Always Somethin'

89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Sun Apr 02, 2017 3:15 pm

Pulling the incorrect (year 96) transmission out of the truck today, getting its replacement rebuilt when it's dropped off, but had another question about EECV. Am I able to change the rev limiter to function by cutting spark instead of cutting fuel? If not, what is there that I could get that would work in conjunction with the ecu and just disable the limiter function in the computer?

decipha

Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by decipha » Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:20 pm

chris... the output port table

the only ecu that does ignition limiting is cbaza cuz i wrote the patch for it :)

you can use an external 2 step to rev limit

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by cgrey8 » Mon Apr 03, 2017 9:28 am

decipha wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:20 pm
chris... the output port table
So just change all the cylinders that are 1s to 2s and vice-versa 2s to 1s.
...Always Somethin'

89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by decipha » Mon Apr 03, 2017 12:32 pm

yes

that table assigns an injector to a hego, u simply swap them

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Thu Apr 27, 2017 11:55 am

Hey guys. Got the correct trams finally and got it rebuilt with my shift kit put in. No more CEL's for trans codes 👍🏻
Getting a p0172 code now, but my passenger side o2 extension wire was resting on the exhaust, and melted a little. Was still reading though. Going to change that extension out and see if it still gives the code.

On to another question. Need an external rev limiter. Turns out an Omex dual coil unit won't work with these coil packs since it uses wasted spark technology on 4 separate coils basically thus not being compatible. Any suggestions on what for a rev limiter now?


As well, still not getting the starter to function via they key. No noise at all. Swapped relays around in distribution box to see if that's all that went bad but still nothing. Fuse #24 in cab is still good (7.5a for starter relay I believe). What else can I check? I'm about to just cut into the distro box and run a trigger wire from the relay to starter but would prefer to not have too. Any help would be appreciated

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by BrooseDaMoose » Fri May 12, 2017 1:04 pm

As well, still not getting the starter to function via they key. No noise at all. Swapped relays around in distribution box to see if that's all that went bad but still nothing. Fuse #24 in cab is still good (7.5a for starter relay I believe). What else can I check? I'm about to just cut into the distro box and run a trigger wire from the relay to starter but would prefer to not have too. Any help would be appreciated
Does the truck have PATS?
2007 Ranger XLT: 4.0L, CAI, Headers
2003 Ranger XLT: Rebuilt 302, Trick Flow TB and intake, aluminum GT40 heads, 270 cam, Flat Top pistons, Hardened rods and stock crank. Rebuilt, upgraded tranny with Advanced Adapters tail to keep 4WD.
Tuning: SCT X3, BE/EA, MongoosePro

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Fri May 12, 2017 4:50 pm

BrooseDaMoose wrote:
Fri May 12, 2017 1:04 pm
As well, still not getting the starter to function via they key. No noise at all. Swapped relays around in distribution box to see if that's all that went bad but still nothing. Fuse #24 in cab is still good (7.5a for starter relay I believe). What else can I check? I'm about to just cut into the distro box and run a trigger wire from the relay to starter but would prefer to not have too. Any help would be appreciated
Does the truck have PATS?
Yes for PATS. Got it figured out though. Was missing a connector. Using a '97 explorer battery cable harness and the AC connector plug is different and I'm assuming the starter ign wire is too. I just ripped in to the distribution box and ran a new wire from the relay to my current starter Ign wire. Does anyone have the wiring for the AC plug that the plug on the battery cable harness plugs in to? Been searching around for that exact wiring because the 97 explorer harness there has only one yellow while the old ranger one has two yellow and all the rest of the wires are the same.

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by BrooseDaMoose » Sun May 14, 2017 7:26 am

Does anyone have the wiring for the AC plug
I have the complete CD but couldn't find exactly what your looking for. PM me your email and I will send you the wiring diagrams.
2007 Ranger XLT: 4.0L, CAI, Headers
2003 Ranger XLT: Rebuilt 302, Trick Flow TB and intake, aluminum GT40 heads, 270 cam, Flat Top pistons, Hardened rods and stock crank. Rebuilt, upgraded tranny with Advanced Adapters tail to keep 4WD.
Tuning: SCT X3, BE/EA, MongoosePro

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Mon May 15, 2017 1:55 am

Got everything running fine for the most part. But running in to some possibly larger issues. IDLE. Can get a fresh tune from the programmer, flash it, truck starts up, sounds like a champ. About 2min later, ecu kicks idle up to 1000-1100, and won't drop down for a while. Got some of that fixed though. Purchased the IAC restrictor plate that all the cam'd mustang guys use, and a new IAC. What's strange, is now after the new IAC, unplugging and plugging in the IAC has no effect on idle. BUT. I think that has fixed one of the issues and that was it having a hanging idle when coming to a stop, and when going from drive to park, it would run up to 1400-1500rpm, then drop down, try to catch an idle for literally a split second and just die out. Would NOT stay running unless I either hit the throttle once or twice or just held a pinch of throttle that would be enough to keep it running when it'd get to around 500rpm.

So now with that new IAC (tried the restrictor plate with old IAC, idle would change when that one was unplugged), the only real driveability issue I'm having is a slightly low idle (can adjust with TB screw just haven't yet) and when I shut the truck off and restart it, it will not idle unless just a pinch of throttle is applied for about 5-10sec, then I can let off and it will hold its own idle. Been going back and forth with the programmer guy trying to get this figured out. Don't think there's a vacuum leak. Small exhaust leak but that shouldn't be causing it to not want to idle after a restart and run fine indefinitely from there on out. Any idea what it could be? I have the datalog file from the most recent driving of the truck if anyone would want to look at that. What I find the most strange is with the new IAC, idle is unchanged when unplugging it, but that also fixed it from idling up then stalling out when going from drive to park. Now the only issue really is it not restarting and staying running without me assisting it. Really pulling my hair out over here.

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by BrooseDaMoose » Mon May 15, 2017 10:55 am

Been going back and forth with the programmer guy...
Can you tell me who you use for tuning? I'm going to need a tune once my engine and tranny are ready.
2007 Ranger XLT: 4.0L, CAI, Headers
2003 Ranger XLT: Rebuilt 302, Trick Flow TB and intake, aluminum GT40 heads, 270 cam, Flat Top pistons, Hardened rods and stock crank. Rebuilt, upgraded tranny with Advanced Adapters tail to keep 4WD.
Tuning: SCT X3, BE/EA, MongoosePro

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Mon May 15, 2017 11:34 am

BrooseDaMoose wrote:
Mon May 15, 2017 10:55 am
Been going back and forth with the programmer guy...
Can you tell me who you use for tuning? I'm going to need a tune once my engine and tranny are ready.
Torrie at Unleashed tuning. Great dude. Knows his stuff. Bought my Livewire TS+, mass air meter and housing and filter adaptor through him. Owner at Pro-M told me there was no way the explorer ecu could ever run the cam that I stuffed in this motor. So far we got it running dang good, only real issue is like I said, on restarts. Still trying to figure out why after swapping for a new IAC that my intake noise went up considerably, and why there's no change when the sensor is plugged in or unplugged. Seems to run better this way though lol

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Fri Jul 28, 2017 9:22 am

Hey all. Got a quick question. Pulled the truck into my garage Monday night after work. It sat Tuesday undistirbed. Wednesday I went to start it, and when I clicked to ignition, the fuel pump relay started clicking rapidly, along with the CEL flickering about the same pace (not flashing, quick than a flash) and theft light was blinking rapidly too. Tried my second key. Same result. Here's a video of the issue: https://youtu.be/SRJ2SBJrnrc

Yesterday just for kicks and giggles, I disconnected the ground and positive battery terminal, disconnected ECU harness, and let it sit for 5min. Connected ecu harness and terminals, turned to ignition and it was fine. Normal operations. Starts fine. Ran fine, both keys worked as they should. My question is; what could have caused this intially? The only time I've seen the theft light flash that quickly is when I'm putting a new tune on the truck. Wondering if it's possibly ground related? I was out at some trails last weekend, and if I'd run across a pothole, it'd cause the truck to "cut out" per say. Would stay running, just would miss a beat. SCT would say "no communication" like ignition signal was lost for a second. Where could I start to look for something like that?

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by LeadHead » Fri Jul 28, 2017 1:36 pm

You've got bad power wiring somewhere. Could be lose or corroded connections. If it doesn't it again, leave the key on and start wiggling connections and wires until it stops.

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Fri Jul 28, 2017 4:53 pm

LeadHead wrote:
Fri Jul 28, 2017 1:36 pm
You've got bad power wiring somewhere. Could be lose or corroded connections. If it doesn't it again, leave the key on and start wiggling connections and wires until it stops.
Points to check first? I tried shaking engine to body harness, no affect in idle while running.

Also when it was doing that, if I pulled the fuel pump relay then turned the key, the CEL would still flicker along with the theft light. Was thinking it was the distribution box fuse, but it seems to be ok. Will change it out at some point here soon still, just to be safe.

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by LeadHead » Sat Jul 29, 2017 11:40 pm

Somewhere on the main power supply to the ECU.

decipha

Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by decipha » Sat Sep 09, 2017 11:59 pm

if the CEL is flashing at key on u prob have a bad ecu

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:00 am

decipha wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 11:59 pm
if the CEL is flashing at key on u prob have a bad ecu
Its not like a normal flash, but very rapid. In sync with the fuel pump relay ticking. Fast enough where my camera on my iPhone 7+ can barely and I mean barely pick up that it's flashing. It's fixed itself now so far, cylinder 7 was 25lbs low on a compression test so I pulled the motor to see what's going on. Throwing some Morel lifters in while it's out, prepping ring gaps for boost as well. Will be throwing twin 50mm turbos on it and capping it at 12psi or 600hp...whichever comes first. Is this ecu able to be tuned properly for running turbo's?

decipha

Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by decipha » Sun Oct 15, 2017 6:02 pm

sounds like a bad relay

yep i've pushed 1100rwhp on the stock ecu no problem

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:46 am

Got the engine back in and going, went to a forged 347 stroker, same cam and stuff just blueprinted and prepped for boost. Got some tuning questions now. I got my MTX-L wideband hooked up last night and drove around some. Tune seemed pretty good, only thing is idle sounds kind of weird. No cam character to it really. Noticed on the Livewire that idle spark is sitting around 20°+\-3°. Seems a little high. I got the log if anyone here would be willing to take a look at the log and see what they think about the overall tune. We're running the system open loop since I dropped the driver side o2 to place the wideband in that spot. Will eventually get another bung welded on, but was wondering if there's a way to have it run closed loop with it set up like that? All it has now is passenger hego, driver is disconnected and was replaced with the wideband

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by cgrey8 » Fri Jan 19, 2018 1:14 pm

If you have a passenger O2, then you should be able to keep the EEC running Closed Loop, and it'll simply fail to running both banks off the working O2. You'll still get a CEL indicating the failure of the Driver O2.

Unless your strategy does something different, most strategies behave this way.
...Always Somethin'

89 Ranger Supercab, 331 w/GT40p heads, ported Explorer lower, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, 1.6RRs, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, Slot Style MAF, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, Innovate LC-1, GUFB, Moates QuarterHorse tuned using BE&EA

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Re: 2000 5.0 ranger swap questions about EECV

Post by DRod » Fri Jan 19, 2018 2:29 pm

cgrey8 wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 1:14 pm
If you have a passenger O2, then you should be able to keep the EEC running Closed Loop, and it'll simply fail to running both banks off the working O2. You'll still get a CEL indicating the failure of the Driver O2.

Unless your strategy does something different, most strategies behave this way.
I asked my tuner about this and he said it wasn't possible...I tried mentioning to him the thing about switching bank 1 to bank 2, and shutting off bank 1, but maybe he hasn't heard of that before. Idk. Hopefully getting it on the dyno today but we'll see!

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