[95gtSTANG]

Hey guys and gals,

First time at track
I have had my mustang since around 2000 and it has been a work in progress-it use to be a daily driver but over the last 5 years it has literally been sitting in my garage and only started occasionally and maybe driven around the block a couple times a year (it is not street legal). I have added quite a bit to it over the last couple months with the goal of taking it out to the track this year and did just that on October 8, 2010-unfortunately and not really surprising the car ran like a total dog. I made two passes a 15.1 and a 15.8

I wasn't exactly sure what to do after the first run so I just added 2 degrees BTDC with the global spark adder and the car felt a little better but I had to let off quite a bit because I thought I felt hesitation or detonation on the top end (although I can't find any evidence of it in the data logs). I think I can get this car into the 13s but it is going to take a lot more work than I was expecting. This was my first time ever racing at the track and MIR was awesome! I wish I could say the same for my time slips.

I am starting this thread to show the world how crappy my car ran and hopefully continue to update it as my car becomes faster making this thread a guide for newbies like me.

My base Tune
My initial tune (switch1.bin) is very basic
-I used an injector template from tuneexchange: http://tunexchange.mustang-tech.org/tem ... -injectors
-MAF curve for my ProM
-And a few of the basic scalars for emission stuff, rev limiter, cui., and other basics.

I have included my tune, my two data logs, and a document that plots a few curves from my data with a couple of notes.

If anyone has suggestions for how I can shave off two seconds please let me know!

[cougarnut281]

Looking at the time slip I think you have enough there for a 13 as the car sits if you learn how to wheel it down the track. The launch is going to be your biggest improvement by far.

As for the tune, just glancing at it you need to lean that thing out.

[95gtSTANG]

Looking at the time slip I think you have enough there for a 13 as the car sits if you learn how to wheel it down the track. The launch is going to be your biggest improvement by far.

As for the tune, just glancing at it you need to lean that thing out.

Thanks! My launches were terrible and I was on street tires-my car seems to be very sluggish on the bottom end and I still have the factory 3.08s. What leads you to believe I could get it in the 13s? My slips seemed pretty terrible.

How would you recommend leaning things out?

[cougarnut281]

The MPH is the key to potential. As it sits I think you should be able to get the 60' time down below 2.0 seconds which will help your times a ton. Gears and sticky tires will make it easier.

To lean it out I would adjust the Fuel - Open Loop Stabilised table in your case. Your actual vs commanded a/f don't quite match but they trend each other pretty well and are close with it being a little on the rich side of commanded. Adjust the top three row to something around 12.6-12.9. I normally make all the lower ones 14.6 too.

[95gtSTANG]

The MPH is the key to potential. As it sits I think you should be able to get the 60' time down below 2.0 seconds which will help your times a ton. Gears and sticky tires will make it easier.

To lean it out I would adjust the Fuel - Open Loop Stabilised table in your case. Your actual vs commanded a/f don't quite match but they trend each other pretty well and are close with it being a little on the rich side of commanded. Adjust the top three row to something around 12.6-12.9. I normally make all the lower ones 14.6 too.

Thank you that is very helpful. I will review my AFR data. You are talking about changing the 90, 80, 70 load rows correct? So essentially, we are leaning out the higher load situations by commanding a slightly larger AFR value.

My Wideand is located at my mac prochamber and my O2s are in basically the factory locations-not sure if that matters too much.

[decipha]

sounds like you need the driver mod lol

[cougarnut281]

Thank you that is very helpful. I will review my AFR data. You are talking about changing the 90, 80, 70 load rows correct? So essentially, we are leaning out the higher load situations by commanding a slightly larger AFR value.

My Wideand is located at my mac prochamber and my O2s are in basically the factory locations-not sure if that matters too much.

You are correct on the fuel table. The o2 location doesn't look like its a problem in the logs so I would roll with it.

[cougarnut281]

sounds like you need the driver mod lol

Drive mod FTW!

[95gtSTANG]

Yes I know my driving sucks right now but hey there are no back roads to practice on here in VA and I haven't power shifted in close to 5 years. So I am happy to just get her above 50 mph. Baby steps for me.

Back to the tuning part
topnotch86 has given good information (by pm) that is inline with cougarnut281's recommendations to adjust my lambses tables to lean out my afr-he also recommends adjusting the my spark tables since everything is still basically stock.

My next step

1)Adjust commanded AFR by adjusting Fuel - Open Loop Base and? Fuel - Open Loop Stabilised
2)Adjust Spark by adjusting Spark - Sea Level Table

[cougarnut281]

Sorry, I didn't mean to be knocking your driving. Learning to launch a stick car at the track can be tricky and certainly takes more than two attempts. Just trying to keep things a little light hearted.

[95gtSTANG]

Sorry, I didn't mean to be knocking your driving. Learning to launch a stick car at the track can be tricky and certainly takes more than two attempts. Just trying to keep things a little light hearted.

no harm no foul, I have thick skin.

[95gtSTANG]

Spark and Fuel Tables

Ok I am going to hit the 1/8 mile today. My next major change will be modifying the fuel and spark tables. For lack of a better starting point I will be using the Aggresive Fuel and Spark settings for iron heads found at tunexchnage: http://tunexchange.mustang-tech.org/tem ... iron-heads

The fuel seems about right but the spark seems only slightly better on the top end-but it should work for a starting point.

[cougarnut281]

Looks like a good step in the right direction. Make sure to post up logs and time slips when you get back. Good Luck!

[95gtSTANG]

Update

Made it to Old Dominion today for the 1/8 mile test and tune. I used the aggressive fuel and spark for iron heads tune and I also remove the tip in retard. Both of my runs were about the same best was 9.75 @71.18 this was just a little better than my previous best. So I guess it is a new best

Major issue tonight was loosing power to the fuel pump, and probably other components too. The tweecer must not be seated correctly because I lost power at the end of both runs-I couldn't figure out what it was (the first time) until I started messing with the connections near the tweecer -the only time the fuel pump hadn't primed in the past was when one of the harness near the EEC was a bit unsecured. I zipped tied a few weeks ago so I didn't think those were the problem-it turns out if I push the EEC upward a bit to try to seat the tweecer better it fired right up.

How the heck are you guys keeping your tweecer secure? I have mine in the kick panel but it just kind of sits there, covered and mostly secure. That doesn't seem to be good enough.

I haven't had much time to look at the logs but I in my second run it looks like I was making good power based on my MPH gradient going into 2nd gear but I got a bit loose and let off a bit. Turns out my first run was the fastest by about a 1/10 s.

No major issues other than the tweecer being loose. I hope to follow up with a more detailed examination of the data logs.

[cougarnut281]

Looking at the logs this is what I notice. The rpm comes down way too far on launch. I would try slipping the clutch some more and juggling the throttle to keep the engine speed up and working for you. also looks like you are shifting about 5200rpm. Have you tried shifting higher?

The tune looks pretty decent, any major gains in et are going to come from driving and hardware changes for now. Sticky tires, maybe gears, hard launch, and hope nothing breaks.

P.S. the first time I ran a 1.7 60' after running 2.0 all the time I about shit myself. You will love the feeling.

[95gtSTANG]

Looking at the logs this is what I notice. The rpm comes down way too far on launch. I would try slipping the clutch some more and juggling the throttle to keep the engine speed up and working for you. also looks like you are shifting about 5200rpm. Have you tried shifting higher?

The tune looks pretty decent, any major gains in et are going to come from driving and hardware changes for now. Sticky tires, maybe gears, hard launch, and hope nothing breaks.

P.S. the first time I ran a 1.7 60' after running 2.0 all the time I about shit myself. You will love the feeling.

Thanks for the tips I will try to work on that.

You asked about shifting-in my second run it looks like I shifted closer to 6k and it looks like I made alot of power there if you look at the mph and the slope of the curve. I had to let off to correct because I got pretty loose. It felt better but I ran basically the same-maybe a bit slower.

I also notice in the first run my lambses are right where I expected them to be at ~12.5 at wot, but in my second run they are richer at 11.7. My AFR track the lambses pretty well a wot, so I am glad about that not sure why there is a discrepency between the first and second run with respect to lambses at wot.

Also, it sounds like you don't think I can gain much more from timing advances? I agree there is much to be gained from getting the power to ground-but what about spark advance? In my runs it looks like my peak at wot is around 29 degrees. With aluminum heads I thought I might be able to advance a bit more, what do you think?

[cougarnut281]

You asked about shifting-in my second run it looks like I shifted closer to 6k and it looks like I made alot of power there if you look at the mph and the slope of the curve. I had to let off to correct because I got pretty loose. It felt better but I ran basically the same-maybe a bit slower.

I would not pay too much attention to that timeslip if you let off. I noticed the one run was looking better all the way up to the 1/8 and then it was slower. I am guessing it was that run. Make sure you are paying attention to all the numbers on your time slip because they can tell a different story than just 1/8 mile times.

I also notice in the first run my lambses are right where I expected them to be at ~12.5 at wot, but in my second run they are richer at 11.7. My AFR track the lambses pretty well a wot, so I am glad about that not sure why there is a discrepency between the first and second run with respect to lambses at wot.

I did not notice that but I didn't look all that hard at a/f. All I did was glance at how close lambse and afr were to each other. You might check and make sure you weren't running off the cold startup table.

Also, it sounds like you don't think I can gain much more from timing advances? I agree there is much to be gained from getting the power to ground-but what about spark advance? In my runs it looks like my peak at wot is around 29 degrees. With aluminum heads I thought I might be able to advance a bit more, what do you think?

I am sure there is power to be had from playing with spark and a/f but I am not a big fan of playing with with them alot unless I have a way to monitor the results. A dyno is best. If you can get consistent timeslips at the track then that works as well. For now you are in the ballpark with a good safe tune and that is my main concern.

[95gtSTANG]

I am starting to look at my load scaling-should I run the EEC calculation to determine my new curve for load scaling? I noticed in first gear my load jumped to over 100 percent for no apparent reason

[cougarnut281]

Looks like a glitch to me, I wouldn't worry about it.

[95gtSTANG]

I have been studying the recent data logs and I can not figure out how my commanded AFR is ~11.67 in my second run-my first run was spot on where I expected it to be at 12.5.

Here are is a slice of data:
Load=73
spark=28.5
rpm=2737
lambse1=11.66
AFR=11.35 (keep in mind just one point, afr is reasonable over time)
ECT=170

I can't seem to figure out where the 11.66 is coming form-most of my multipliers are one-the only place I see something close to this value is in the Open Loop Start Up Table (fn1361) (time vs. Temp vs. value to subtract). If I recall, my car did stall when I did a burn out-is it possible that not enough time passed and I was at a point of the table (15secx170degx.92). I felt like it took longer than 15 seconds to stage though. But the math sort of works out 12.5-.92=11.58. Except now that I look at the log- you can see where the car stalled and there is a good 20 s that pass before I take off.

The other place I see value of 11.xx is the open loop min scalar-logs show I was closed loop during runs. Doesn't quite add up-most of the multipliers are set to 1. Fuel Open Loop base is leaner at these data points. WTF!:!

Need more data!!!

[cougarnut281]

Bump this after the weekend for me and I will try to find some time to look into it. It's looking like I am not going to have a life this weekend (work) and I need to get some sleep.

[decipha]

Sorry, I didn't mean to be knocking your driving. Learning to launch a stick car at the track can be tricky and certainly takes more than two attempts. Just trying to keep things a little light hearted.

no harm no foul, I have thick skin.

sounds like you need the weight reduction mod, time to cut back on your carbohydrates.

[95gtSTANG]

I pulled the EEC and the tweecer the other day to better secure the tweecer on to the j3 port. I made a card board washer style spacer for the tweecer that fit nicely. I also used two large strips of Silver duct tape to Fasten the tweecer to the EEC-that sucker isn't going any where. Hopefully this will cure my connection problem.

[decipha]

surprised it hadn't been mentioned but have you tried cutting back spark on launch at those high load low rpm's to aid in traction?

i do that pretty often when folks just can't hook

[95gtSTANG]

surprised it hadn't been mentioned but have you tried cutting back spark on launch at those high load low rpm's to aid in traction?

i do that pretty often when folks just can't hook

Well to be honest I am not really spinning that much off the line-I think maybe I need to try launching harder I feel like the car is very sluggish when I take off (no gears, lots of induction)-but as you can see from the data logs I am not really taking off at WOT so I think I could probably shave some time off with better driving.

I have only launched the car 4 times in the last 5 years-and those are the 4 runs I have posted in this thread My track days are limited so I would like to make it back a couple more times before the season is over.

[95gtSTANG]

UPDATE

Made it to the track today before taking the little one's out for tricks and treats .

All three runs were with the same tune that I used last time when my car konked out because of the bad tweecer connection. The tune should be called switch3 with aggressive fuel and spark.

I made 3 fairly clean runs- First two were nearly identical ran 14.4 @~98 both times. The biggest issue I noticed was at around 5500 rpm (right when I shifting in 2nd and 3rd gear) I am hearing/feeling some sort of stuttering/detonation/valve chatter??. Same sounds I have described before not sure what it is. I am sure I heard it the first run-not sure about second and I don't think I heard the sound in the 3rd run.

The last one was very nice shaved off .3 seconds and made my best run to date-
14.12 @ 99.45 mph w/ 2.218 60ft

I haven't had much time to dig into what is so different about the last run-maybe some of the experts can weight in

Bottom line-I have shaved 1 second off my previous best 1/4 mile run with very little changes and there is still room to improve the 60 ft! I think I should be in the 13s as the car sits.

[MikeB]

Good deal. Get some sticky tires and some adjustable upper control arms to dial in that pinion angle to come out of the hole hard.

[95gtSTANG]

Good deal. Get some sticky tires and some adjustable upper control arms to dial in that pinion angle to come out of the hole hard.

Indeed-sticky tires and gear are in my future. I have the wheels-I decided on a set of prostars 15x8 and 15x5. I need to pick out some tires though. Also, I have a bottle just aching to be sprayed!

Have you sent your's down the quarter mile yet? Is it an auto?

[MikeB]

I have but it was a different combo. Best I ever ran with the TFS top end kit was a 13 oh's with the slushbox 120k rear suspension.

I'm currently building an 11:1 306 w/ 255 crank, lightweight rotating assy. TFS 170/RPM 2/N-71 combo on a 150 shot.

Should be fun.

[cougarnut281]

Glad to hear it, I just glanced at the timeslips for the moment and I can tell you right now that most of the difference between run 3 and the others happened between the 60 and 330.

I'll hit up the logs after dinner.

P.S. Your MPH is looking good for a low 13, high 12.